¿Si Se Puede?
Que' lo que pasa aqui, ah? What's goin' on up in here, up in here!?
Viva Fidel, viva Obama? Is this still AMERICA? What happened to freedom of speech? Now el Presidente Obama has weighed in and wants you to SHUT UP!
I'm talking about whats going on in these town hall meetings around the country... Forgive me if I have it all wrong, but isn't the purpose of these town hall meetings for the people to voice their opinions to their local representatives on what they want THEIR representatives, that represent THEM, to do for them.
I am the first to say, hey we lost the election, they won, its their turn to implement their policies. But does that mean that we lose our voice, our freedom of speech altogether? Don't we still have a say?
Barack Obama says he wants us to get out of the way, he wants us to stop talking because he's fixing our mess... whaaaaaaat? Aren't they the ones during the Bush years that said that dissent is the purest form of patriotism? What about all those anti-Bush protests? And all they were, was ANTI-BUSH. These people are voicing their opinions against the health care bill through the proper channels, not protesting in the streets, which is also our right to do so.
Obama is starting to sound a lot like Fidel Castro and Hugo Chavez and some other guy with a little mustache in his speeches. He is just firing up the people, pitting us against each other in his exuberant speeches. Dividing us more and more with every word, phrase, and voice inflection.
Mi gente, my people, all Americans... this is not what made this country great. This kind of 'leadership' is what led to the rise of dictators all around the world and all throughout time.
This is not America. We are being silenced.
Sure, all the liberals, democrats, leftists, they, you are happy with this, and I kinda get it because he is supporting what you want..... right now. What will happen when he disagrees with you? Or is he perfect and he knows exactly what you want all the time? The day will come when he infringes on you, I promise.
CHINO
August 11th, 2009 - 06:01
am i crazy? please let me know…
August 11th, 2009 - 08:37
I really haven’t noticed him telling people to stop talking. I imagine he’s getting pretty tired of the scare tactics that keep popping up. Convincing old people that their Medicaid is going to be unfunded or that they will be euthanized or that they’ll DIE waiting for a doctor with the new plan. It’s just getting a little ridiculous.
The emphasis is mostly on a tiny number of examples, many of them false or based on incorrect assumptions, of people who are in some way unhappy with their European or Canadian health care systems. Now I’m pretty sure if we worked at it, we could find an equal or perhaps even greater (gee, how unlikely is that) number of Americans displeased by their health care system, but you’d never know that.
One of the things I’ve always liked about Obama was his willingness to hear what the people are saying. I don’t always like his answers, but at least he tries to listen.
What town hall meeting are you talking about? I don’t have a tv, so I do miss things, could you link to an example of what you are talking about?
-Jennie
August 11th, 2009 - 09:51
There are various town hall meetings going on around the country where people are showing up to show their displeasure.
But the great news is what you said about always liking that Obama listens to folks. That is great because when you finally realize that its not true, you too will feel betrayed and start to open your eyes.
YOU have not noticed him telling his dissenters to stop talking, to get out of the way…. so did I make this up? Am I fabricating a lie because I hate him? No, on both counts. The man, Barack Obama is inconsequential to me. He seems like a cool guy that I could hang with and I’d love to debate him and show him where he is wrong. But its the office of the President and the person who is in his position saying, proposing and doing what he is doing that I am opposed to.
I wonder Junior if you can find the clip of Obama saying these things and if it is even possible for us to post it here.
After all, our purpose is to inform, not propagandize.
August 11th, 2009 - 10:16
Ok, I will have more to say, but for now…
Jennie, have you not seen reports of the White House asking people to rat on people who make dissenting remarks about health care reform? Or perhaps the comments by Speaker Pelosi about concerned citizens carrying Swastikas? People who have the Constitutional right to assemble, being called “un-American” by her. What gives?
About the President’s willingness to listen to the people is this why he has said “Health Care Reform WILL happen”? With thousands of American expressing growing concern about the lack of detail being provided to us about how health care will be provided, administered and more importantly, how it will be paid for. Has he been willing to listen to, and provide details to refute what the Congressional Budget Office has stipulated about paying for this plan?
August 11th, 2009 - 10:21
But he’s sooooo dreamy… ::eyelashes fluttering::
August 11th, 2009 - 10:22
I know you get a tingle down your leg Chino
August 11th, 2009 - 12:06
Ok, I went to Youtube and found lots of clips of people being rude at townhall meetings.
I really haven’t heard about the ratting on people who make dissenting remarks, that kinda sounds made up. I also haven’t heard what Pelosi said about swastikas, but I’d bet it was a dumb comment taken out of context. ‘Un-American’ gets bantered about by both sides I guess, it’s just as ridiculous from her as it is from the right.
August 11th, 2009 - 12:12
“..because when you finally realize that its not true, you too will feel betrayed and start to open your eyes.”
Hahahaha… that’s kinda funny. Not everyone who voted for him is deeply in love with him. He wasn’t my first or second choice. I didn’t even caucus for him. He’s avoided or scoffed at things I think are important and he’s totally missing the mark with his stimulous plan.
My eyes are open, I’m just not seeing what you are.
August 11th, 2009 - 13:54
Ok, so how about this?: http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/facts-are-stubborn-things/
Pay particular attention to this part:
“These rumors often travel just below the surface via chain emails or through casual conversation. Since we can’t keep track of all of them here at the White House, we’re asking for your help. If you get an email or see something on the web about health insurance reform that seems fishy, send it to flag@whitehouse.gov.”
Straight from the perpetrator! Tell me this does not dissuade, as the President likes to call us, “ordinary Americans”, from speaking their minds. This is not a “shut up” message? Oh wait, maybe this is what you meant about his willingness to listen to people… or their conversations anyway. Let us recognize that the White is not subject to the Privacy Laws that protect Americans. Once the White House has your name, it has it for life! Look it up. I’m not gonna do all your homework for you
August 11th, 2009 - 14:00
Jennie, my previous comment was for you by the way. Now you will have heard, and better yet, seen, with your own eyes that they are asking us to rat on dissenting Americans. What up wit dat?!?! The White House?!?!
August 11th, 2009 - 14:14
Excellent work partner. I still dont like Jennie that you think I would ”make up” something. When I say someone said something its because I personally HEARD them say it. I, like you, dont take 3rd party info as fact, but I dont dismiss it as made up because i disagree with it.
August 12th, 2009 - 19:03
Hey guys, relax will you?
Really, the government already has your name unless you are straight off the boat, so that point is moot as well.
Here’s some reading on healthcare similar to what Obama I think is proposing. http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2009/08/not-all-socialist-countries-are-alike.html
Really, the way people are reacting out of control are just making Americans look ridiculous. Asking for tips is not a “shut up” message. Until you have proof that a tip sent to that email address resulted in silencing of something, your claim won’t hold up in court.
Also, don’t forget that there already is government supported healthcare in place… it’s called Medicare and Medicaid.
August 17th, 2009 - 13:06
Kat, he has TOLD us to ”stay out of the way” & that he wishes we would just ”stop talking” Notice the quotation marks, his words. Stop talking in context is translated to shut up. And asking for tips!?!? That is SOOOOOO 1984!! Do you not see that? If you work for the ministry, you rat on those that badmouth them, and those that dont fall in line become proles.
August 19th, 2009 - 09:01
Hmm… ok… my thoughts here.
Jr: “Tell me this does not dissuade, as the President likes to call us, “ordinary Americans”, from speaking their minds. This is not a “shut up” message?”
Asking for help in identifying rumors, doesn’t sound like a shut up message to ME. But, I can see how you would see it as such. I’m pretty sure they won’t be sending the thought police out to get people though. Nobody has the money for thought police. (It all got spent bailing out banks.)
Chino: “I still dont like Jennie that you think I would ”make up” something.”
My apologies Chino, the trouble with written communication is it looses emphasis and body language. I should have been more clear, I was not saying YOU made it up. I have you pegged as an honest sortta guy.
I was trying to say it sounded like something that didn’t really exist.
What I see is someone trying to help dispel misinformation, not someone looking to silence those opposed to his plan.
I watched your montage video. I have to say, I would love to see this country try something new with health care, I haven’t liked the available options. Public option, single payer… these sound like decent enough things to try. I don’t think the co-op thing I heard about yesterday sounds like a good idea, but so far that’s not even in the bill.
Could y’all touch on specific things with Public option or single payer that you’re really concerned about? Bonus points if the things you focus on are actually in a piece of legislation.
August 19th, 2009 - 13:13
I love your approach Jennie. We should all try to be a little more like that, myself included.
But that aint happenin’!! lol!!!
But seriously, this is my whole deal with that and any socialist ideal….
I work. I have worked for a long time to build up a good work history to where i can get a good job with a good company with good benefits. I have Blue Cross-Blue Shield health insurance and dont really pay all that much for it considering what insurance costs are these days. I love it, I see whatver dr i want whenever i want to, including dental AND vision.
Am i just lucky, or did i work for that? Rhetorical question. it aint luck!
What benefit or reward do i get from a govt run system? Dont tell me the service will be the same. Dont tell me my taxes wont go up. I can only lose.
Why should i lose, didnt i do the right thing? What do i owe anybody for the priveledge?
A friend of mine argued that she would like her brother to be insured. I said sure, you pay for him, no one is stopping you. His lazy ass has never had a steady job and would rather smoke weed than punch a clock. Why should i pay for him?
August 20th, 2009 - 12:08
Yes, there will be lazy people who end up with a free ride. I don’t see how they could manage to exclude them.
There will also be pregnant women who lose their job with benefits when they get too rotund to do the work expected of them by their employer. (happened to me)
There will be recent widows/widowers or divorcees, people who worked in the informal economy for 20/30/40 years while their spouse worked in the formal economy, they are probably not going to land a job with benefits right away, does that mean they don’t deserve to see a doctor?
There will also be working poor people, who like you, work, work hard, just can’t seem to dig themselves out of their paycheck to paycheck existence. (My husband, has never been unemployed, equally has never had health insurance)
There would also be those who can’t get health insurance because of health problems. In most areas there are only 1 or 2 health insurance providers, if those 1 or 2 decide your diabetes is too high risk or whatever, and refuse to offer you coverage…. what are you supposed to do? Currently there’s no other option for these people.
You ask the question, why should I pay for them?
I put forth that it’s your responsibility as a member of society to help those who share the society with you. It’s the cost of living in a society. You are not an island. You depend on waitresses and bus drivers and cashiers for services, in turn why shouldn’t you help ease their pain should they fall ill?
You claim to not like socialist ideals… but roads are maintained in a socialist manner. People who might not even use the roads contribute tax dollars towards the upkeep, for the common good.
You depend on the firetrucks to come put out fires, even if your neighbor is behind on taxes and such, you still want the firemen coming out to put out his house fire, otherwise it might spread to your house.
You support 3-6 elderly people with your social security taxes (I forget the number). Those people more than likely have worked in the past, but that doesn’t change the fact that they need help now. Do you want to see that socialist program ended?
Social services do disproportionately help those who are poor and/or not working. It is often the case that those in need of help are those least able to afford it. You ask what benefit you’ll see. The answer is very little. But wouldn’t you like to see a system in place in case something should happen to you and your wife and kids find themselves in need? What about your parents? Are they going to be healthy and working until the day they die? Ask yourself if you really want to be the type of person that only cares about what can benefit you personally.
I personally would be honored to live in a society that takes care of the sick, the elderly and the unemployed. When I’m gainfully employed and sending in tax money it makes me proud, and that’s my preferred relationship with the social systems, but when life changes and I find myself in need of those same services, it’s nice to know they are there.
And if you can excuse a bible quotation from this little pagan, I will leave you with this:
On the last day, Jesus will say to those on His right hand, “Come, enter the Kingdom. For I was hungry and you gave me food, I was thirsty and you gave me drink, I was sick and you visited me.” Then Jesus will turn to those on His left hand and say, “Depart from me because I was hungry and you did not feed me, I was thirsty and you did not give me to drink, I was sick and you did not visit me.” These will ask Him, “When did we see You hungry, or thirsty or sick and did not come to Your help?” And Jesus will answer them, “Whatever you neglected to do unto one of these least of these, you neglected to do unto Me!” Matthew 25: 35-40
August 22nd, 2009 - 09:13
Jennie, Jennie, Jennie. I hope you realize and admit to what political philosophy you believe in. You are a communist, plain and simple. Thats OK, you’re free to be what you wanna be and believe what you wanna believe in.
But like the other post which you called unproductive, or something like that, if you are a communist what are you doing here in the United States of AMERICA? If you like that system so much why don’t you move to Russia or Cuba or even Canada where you’d probably be happier. (but you’d probably have to share most of that lovely crop to people who need it more than your family)
I once spoke to a young Russian woman, from Siberia, and we got to talking politics, she loves her homeland of course but hated the way the government ran her life. So she left, she loves it here and is a true entrepreneur. One last thing she said, “At least everyone gets a house.” Thats where I ended the conversation.